[00:00:00] Speaker A: Many founders begin their businesses because they see an opportunity in the market. But sometimes the motivation is much more personal. My guest today is Dr. Vorongzi Puthukul, known to many as Dr. Ying, founder of Math and Science Talent, an education company that has expanded across several countries in Southeast Asia. But Dr. Ying's journey started in a very different place. As a child who actually struggled with maths, a teacher who changed her perspective on learning ultimately inspired a career in education and. And a business that now helps thousands of students approach mathematics in a completely different way.
I met Dr. Ying through the APEC Women's Business Activator program, which I design and facilitate to help women founders expand their businesses internationally. Ferongzi, Amazing to have you on the show today.
And I wanted to, you know, I wanted to start back at the beginning because I know that you told me that when you were a child, you actually disliked mathematics, but here you are today running a highly successful maths platform.
What changed your relationship with maths?
[00:01:08] Speaker B: Yeah, it's bad already.
[00:01:11] Speaker A: Yeah. Like what? What changed?
[00:01:12] Speaker B: What.
[00:01:13] Speaker A: What made you change your mind about. About maths?
[00:01:16] Speaker B: When I watched, I try, I didn't. I. I didn't like mathematics, but I met very beautiful mathematics teacher. She changed my mind to love in mathematics.
She taught me by game, toys and experiment in mathematics. That is very wonderful.
[00:01:38] Speaker A: That's amazing. How old were you when you met her?
[00:01:41] Speaker B: Maybe around six years.
Six years old.
[00:01:46] Speaker A: So you were just a little, little tiny girl when you met her?
Just a small child and you were saying she taught with games and toys and things.
What was that? Was that very different to the way that other people were teaching maths?
[00:02:02] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:02:03] Speaker A: Tell me about that.
[00:02:05] Speaker B: For example, you know uno game. You know uno game?
[00:02:09] Speaker A: Yeah, I love that game. My kids love that game.
[00:02:11] Speaker B: Yes, yes, because same, same. Like this game, if you put number two and I put number two, how much is this?
Plus two equal four. Okay. Two. Multiple. Two equal four. Yes, same, same. I like this.
[00:02:30] Speaker A: And so.
[00:02:30] Speaker B: And she is very beautiful.
[00:02:32] Speaker A: Oh, she was also very beautiful.
[00:02:35] Speaker B: I want to be her.
[00:02:36] Speaker A: Okay.
And so that was that. Yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense. And so how did that experience with your beautiful maths teacher, how did it shape your decision to build a business around mathematics education?
[00:02:55] Speaker B: When I was si, I didn't like mathematics, but when I met her, I changed my mind to love in mathematics. I want to put this feeling to the students around the world because the student, the, you know, there are a lot of students don't like mathematics because it is very difficult and very serious.
And they are very nervous about the word problem.
That's why I want to change them online.
And that's why I opened Math Thailand by Dr. Yi. Oh wow.
[00:03:30] Speaker A: And how old were you when you decided that you wanted to share this love of maths with other students?
[00:03:37] Speaker B: Around 12.
[00:03:39] Speaker A: About 12.
[00:03:41] Speaker B: And I, I, I want to be a teacher because I want to be a beautiful teacher mathematics in the world.
[00:03:49] Speaker A: Just like your maths teacher.
And you, you. When we were chatting before we started recording the other day, you shared a very powerful story about how your dad supported your dream. Can. Can you tell me a bit about when you first decided to start the business and and what your dad did for you?
[00:04:09] Speaker B: Okay.
I study in bachelor degree and master degree in mathematic teacher.
[00:04:18] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:04:19] Speaker B: Mathematic teacher in faculty of education at J University.
And then I study in PhD in research Meteorology and I think I want to open my own business.
I didn't have money and my father didn't have money also.
He said okay, follow your name.
He just only had one house in his life for his whole life. A whole life in whole life. He will, he gave, he gave this house to me to go to the bank. And you will, and I will get a money to run my business. Follow your dream. Don't worry about everything.
If you okay, I'm okay. If you didn't. Okay, don't worry. This is the last thing in his life he can do for me.
[00:05:19] Speaker A: Wow. That, that is just so incredible. That just like brings up goosebumps on my arms to hear you tell that story. And your dad just must have cared about you so much to. You know, to basically put everything at risk for you.
[00:05:34] Speaker B: He believed in me.
[00:05:36] Speaker A: Yeah. And how did you feel when he did that for you?
[00:05:39] Speaker B: I think I have to do everything the best.
[00:05:44] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:05:45] Speaker B: I have to do everything best because my father believe in me. And then I should believe in me also. Yeah yeah yeah. When I have a lot of problem when I run my business.
Okay. I have to keep it on. Don't worry anything. Keep it on going on.
[00:06:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:06:08] Speaker B: You have been follow your name. Your father believe in you?
[00:06:13] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:06:15] Speaker B: He will tell me.
[00:06:16] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:06:17] Speaker B: About this story.
[00:06:20] Speaker A: And so your dad gave you the money and you opened the company.
Tell me, can you remember what was the first year of the business like?
[00:06:28] Speaker B: Well, very good. Because it is my dream and I think this method very good for every student to learn in this way that why when I open just only three months I can return the money to my father.
[00:06:51] Speaker A: Really?
[00:06:52] Speaker B: Yes. And bring the house from the bank.
[00:06:56] Speaker A: So what, what made it go so fast in those first three months, do you think?
[00:07:00] Speaker B: Because this method is renewed and can solve the problems about the mathematics students.
[00:07:10] Speaker A: Wow.
And so what was the point?
What was the moment where you decided wow, this is going so well.
I'm going to expand this outside Thailand. Do you remember the moment when that happened?
[00:07:24] Speaker B: Yes, because I'm very lucky. There are a lot of parents and children came to study with me. Around 300 students in one single. But the parents told me okay, you should open in next month around his allow his house.
Yes, because they want to come. But it is very far from from him. Yeah. You should open in this center. Okay. That why I open.
And I'm lucky again that a lot of parents want to buy and want to open and maybe want to buy my franchise to open around his house also.
[00:08:14] Speaker A: Okay, so you did Thailand first and then you started to go to other international markets.
[00:08:21] Speaker B: Yes, and then I decided to open in Laos because the owner came to Thailand and see a lot of bad talent in Thailand. They want to open in Laos also. But very amazing. Just only one year they can return a lot of return the whole money return.
[00:08:43] Speaker A: Really.
[00:08:44] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:08:45] Speaker A: And was expanding into Laos. Very different. I mean, Laos and Thailand are next to each other.
But did you find any difficulty in opening in a new country in Philippines? Tell me about that.
[00:09:00] Speaker B: Yeah, in Philippines and very lucky also because in Philippines she.
She married in Thai people.
[00:09:09] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:09:10] Speaker B: And then she bring her son and daughter to learn Math Thailand in Thailand and she want to open in the Philippines. It is very difficult because she has to adapt the curriculum and the method of teaching to suit the student in free page.
[00:09:34] Speaker A: And is it very different what children learn in Thailand and the field? It's the maths is different.
[00:09:40] Speaker B: Not the math not different but about the it is very news. Very news. In freebie you have to build and you have to bring every people know you first about what is my talent.
[00:09:59] Speaker A: Yeah. So people didn't really know you. So yeah, I didn't. You were not well known. And so now how many. How many countries are you operating math talent in?
[00:10:11] Speaker B: I have three countries. Thailand now and the Philippines.
Next week I am going to Singapore.
[00:10:19] Speaker A: Oh wow.
[00:10:20] Speaker B: I'm going to Singapore to meeting investor
[00:10:25] Speaker A: to meet an investor in Singapore.
[00:10:27] Speaker B: And next month in Malaysia and Indonesia.
[00:10:32] Speaker A: Goodness. So that's going really quickly now.
[00:10:35] Speaker B: But not. Not sure.
Okay. Or not. I'm not sure.
[00:10:40] Speaker A: Yeah, but still that I I do buy.
[00:10:43] Speaker B: I follow my lead.
[00:10:45] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:10:45] Speaker B: I I and I got a lot of new knowledge from you. From Epic Women business activator. Yes. About the right customers, like location, how to. How to land my franchise. And focus on your customer. Focus on your dream.
[00:11:07] Speaker A: On your dream. Yes.
[00:11:08] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:11:08] Speaker A: I think the dream is so important.
Well, that is great to know.
That is so good to know. I'm really interested to know from you as well.
We were talking about maths talent centers.
Do most students access the maths talent material at a center or is it online through a platform or is it both on site?
[00:11:36] Speaker B: A lot of students come to study in Met talent center.
[00:11:41] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:11:43] Speaker B: Because there are really kids and just only 3 to 12.
[00:11:50] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:11:51] Speaker B: And the parent in Thailand don't like online.
[00:11:58] Speaker A: They don't like online. Okay. So they would prefer their children to go to a center and learn from a real person.
I can understand that.
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[email protected] and we'll put a link in the description and tell me about the intellectual property in the platform. So, you know, you started to like maths from your beautiful teacher. Then you went on and you studied maths and you did a master's and then you did a PhD.
Did you apply a lot of what you learned in your studies into the platform? Did what you did at university inform what went into the maths platform?
[00:13:23] Speaker B: Platform?
I.
I did my PhD research about teaching mathematic Very happy for students.
And then I get to ask. I open.
I've been a theory and how to teach your children. Very happy.
[00:13:45] Speaker A: Yeah. How to teach the students in a way that makes them love maths.
And was it hard to translate the learning that you got into a platform?
[00:13:56] Speaker B: No, I study everything in my bachelor degree and yes, it's very easy for me.
[00:14:05] Speaker A: That's good. Well, that is amazing.
So where, I mean, you mentioned some of the countries that you're going to go to next. I think you said Malaysia and Singapore and Indonesia.
[00:14:19] Speaker B: I think Singapore are quite difficult for me.
[00:14:23] Speaker A: Quite different. Why is that?
[00:14:25] Speaker B: Because I think people in Singapore like Singapore Math.
[00:14:29] Speaker A: They like Singapore Maths.
[00:14:31] Speaker B: But I will tell them, okay, I will teach Singapore Math. Bi. Visual thinking.
[00:14:38] Speaker A: Yes.
And do you think that the Thai way of doing maths can work anywhere in the world? I mean, could Math talent come to Australia?
Could it go to Canada? Could it go to Europe or the United States? What do you think that could work?
[00:14:57] Speaker B: Because I'm not sure. I told you already my teaching method.
Verify by Finland.
[00:15:05] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:15:06] Speaker B: Verify by Finland.
Visual map. Yeah. I think it is so for everybody in every country.
But it depends on the students. It depends the student. Like this way or not?
[00:15:21] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:15:23] Speaker B: That is your student.
[00:15:27] Speaker A: Yes. From all over the world.
[00:15:30] Speaker B: Visual math and visual science.
[00:15:33] Speaker A: What are the biggest differences that you've seen between students in the different countries?
[00:15:39] Speaker B: I think it is very difficult.
We have to build a system first, not just a school. We have curriculum, teacher training and creative control. We can still. To other countries. If I have a system.
[00:15:56] Speaker A: Yes.
Yes. And in terms of the actual students, do you think that children are ready to learn maths the same way everywhere in the world? Or do you think that the children in different countries have different preferences for how they learn maths?
[00:16:15] Speaker B: I think I should do the research first for the country style they like and what style they don't like.
[00:16:24] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:16:25] Speaker B: Adapt the curriculum and teaching method.
[00:16:28] Speaker A: Yes.
Yeah. Furngsi International business. Some days it can be quite challenging.
Was there ever a moment when you were running math Talent while you've been running it where the outcome was not obvious, where you thought, I don't know if this will work. So I know in your first year it was really good and you refunded all the money to your dad and it grew. But has there ever been a moment where you've thought, I'm not sure how this is going to work out?
[00:17:00] Speaker B: I think we should focus on the dry market first. The right customer and a stock system and Great, right?
[00:17:09] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:17:10] Speaker B: The right partner. It is very important if I.
If I meet the right partner. I think yes.
[00:17:20] Speaker A: To. To that place.
[00:17:21] Speaker B: The right partner in this country.
[00:17:24] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:17:25] Speaker B: You should know that for your Dan.
[00:17:28] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:17:29] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:17:32] Speaker A: You've been building maths talent for more than a decade. It's been more than 10 years.
How has the experience of running the company changed you as a person and as a leader? Do you think I.
[00:17:52] Speaker B: The first, don't go too fast with our system.
[00:17:56] Speaker A: Okay. You learned not to go too fast with your system.
[00:17:59] Speaker B: Yes, with our system. Second, choose the right partner.
[00:18:04] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:18:06] Speaker B: Choose the right partner.
[00:18:08] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:18:09] Speaker B: Yes. And third, know you are customary.
[00:18:14] Speaker A: Yes.
And if you could go back and talk to the younger version of Ferongzi 10 years ago when you started to build math talent, we. What would, what would you tell her?
[00:18:23] Speaker B: You are really amazing girl. You are very amazing.
A lot of passion in your life.
Make me proud of you.
You are going to be.
[00:18:45] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:18:46] Speaker B: Around.
Yes. So your name, do everything your father.
How are you?
And me too.
[00:19:01] Speaker A: Well, look, it is just incredible what you have done with maths talent. It's such an important business.
I just know you are making a huge impact on children and how they say maths and how they see the world. And I know so many children hate maths just the way that you did when you were little. But maths is so important for kids and I think if you can change the way that the next generation of children sees maths, that has the impact to have a transformative, a transformative impact on the world and how it works.
[00:19:39] Speaker B: I have a lot of students before they came to Sudhi in Thailand, they got a lowest goal.
[00:19:49] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:19:50] Speaker B: Then when they studied with me around three months, they got a top score.
[00:19:59] Speaker A: Only three months. That's amazing.
And is maths talent for all students or just students who don't like maths?
[00:20:11] Speaker B: Maybe some students like mathematics but they want to be better.
[00:20:18] Speaker A: Better.
[00:20:19] Speaker B: I can, I, I, I can do.
[00:20:22] Speaker A: That's incredible. Well, Varongsi, I have. I've so enjoyed talking to you today.
Your story is so beautiful and it's so inspiring to see what you're doing. And I just wish you every success as you keep expanding maths talent across Southeast Asia and maybe the rest of the world and changing the lives of all those kids out there.
[00:20:45] Speaker B: Very happy. And I'm really lucky you invite me to Chamomile.
[00:20:51] Speaker A: Well, I'm so pleased you could come on the show and I look forward to seeing you again in the not too distant future
[00:20:59] Speaker B: alumni meeting about.
[00:21:02] Speaker A: I think that would be great. I think we should try to ask if we can organize that.
Well, that's great. Thank you.
